Now updated: Ramadan calendar -

can a muslim pledge alliegence to a flag?

asked 109 mikejm4's gravatar image
closed Jun 30 at 19:53 123 AbduAllah (suspended) 123%20AbduAllah's gravatar image

Number 4 hahaa . Im waiting for the day of number zero.

(Dec 03 '13 at 19:03) sadie ♦ sadie's gravatar image

sarah, yaqin can curse me and bibi can say i have no heart, but that was just mean. i thought as a fellow american, that was a good question for you. and i thought you were defending freedom of speech when you asked "why?" on the community page. you are hard to get a read on, i'll give you that. one day you say, well don't commit adultery and you won't get stoned, the next you are challenging bibi on stoning being in the koran.

if you don't know the answer you can admit that. it's a tricky one. what do you do at sporting events? as president-elect would swear to uphold the constitution?

(Dec 03 '13 at 19:31) mikejm4 mikejm4's gravatar image

I won't do anything that goes against Qur'an and Authenticated Sunnah. Mike please forgive me I really thought you would find it funny. I wasn't trying to be mean. Brutally honest , not mean. Disifier the difference if you can. I did say if you don't want to be stoned to death then don't commit adultery. That wad before I understood the verses correctly ECT. Either way the point is if you don't want to pay the price then I suggest not to do it. No one should be able to read as I am not a book. Lol. Try mike just remember to try is to fail.

(Dec 03 '13 at 19:58) sadie ♦ sadie's gravatar image

it's all good. i took no offense, i was kidding. i was even looking forward to seeing my account "permenantly" suspended today so i could be mikejmzero. ;) so yes i actually did find it funny.

so you translate zina as both adultery and fornication and the 2nd verse of the 24th surah is arbogating stoning. did you pick up muhammad asads translation? or yusuf ali's?

tru dat, you are no book. no woman ever is. :) just look at your name sake. first she gives her handmaiden to her husband, then forces him to turn them out. it's a woamn's perogative.

you have a good day sadie.

(Dec 04 '13 at 09:43) mikejm4 mikejm4's gravatar image

how was work last night?

(Dec 07 '13 at 11:01) mikejm4 mikejm4's gravatar image

The caliph al-Mahdi entered the Mosque of the Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) and the people all stood up for him except Imam Ibn Abi Dhi’b. It was said to him: Stand up; this is the Ameer al-Mu’mineen. He said: The people should only stand up for the Lord of the Worlds. 

Al-Mahdi said: Let him be, for all the hairs of my head have stood on end. 

Siyar A’laam al-Nubala’ (7/144). 

The scholars of the Standing Committee were asked: Is it permissible to stand to show respect to any national anthem or flag? 

They replied: 

It is not permissible for the Muslim to stand out of respect for any national anthem or flag, rather this is a reprehensible innovation which was not known at the time of the Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) or at the time of the Rightly-Guided Caliphs (may Allaah be pleased with them), and it is contrary to perfect Tawheed and sincere veneration of Allaah alone. It is also a means that leads to shirk and is an imitation of the kuffaar in their reprehensible customs, and following them in their exaggeration about their presidents and in their ceremonies. The Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) forbade imitating them.  

And Allaah is the Source of strength; may Allaah send blessings and peace upon our Prophet Muhammad and his family and companions. End quote. 

Fataawa al-Lajnah al-Daa’imah (1/235). 

answered 73210 Light's gravatar image

@Light may Allah reward you, this point is clear to those that are upon the haqq, I fear this mainstream islam, for it is the doorway to bidah. Salaam

(Dec 05 '13 at 18:59) yaqin ♦ yaqin's gravatar image

yaqin, do me a favor. like you said to the gay kid, not to call himself muslim, you shouldn't call yourself an american. you either sadie. as for your boy light here quoting from what a hypocrite. he comes to america to study in our university system and then shows no respect.

thank you all though for your honesty it has motivated me.

(Dec 06 '13 at 12:28) mikejm4 mikejm4's gravatar image

@Mike touchy, touchy, as long as I have been dealing with you I never seen you like this, but because I like you so much I will grant you your request. Salaam

(Dec 06 '13 at 12:46) yaqin ♦ yaqin's gravatar image

yes, it did touch me very much. enraged me even. my first draft had several expletives. but i know how sensitive y'alls virgin ears are. may the warm embrace of america's bossom keep you forever safe, while she keeps your insane ideology ever distant from our shores.

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.

(Dec 06 '13 at 13:48) mikejm4 mikejm4's gravatar image

Awe your a patriot how cute. May the united states of America stand with you in front of your cherisher and creator the day no one can hide. Allah is Akbar. Salaam

(Dec 06 '13 at 15:16) sadie ♦ sadie's gravatar image

Oops my bad really , touch screen phone deleted your wonderful comment. I meant to hit the comment box. Allah is Akbar.

(Dec 06 '13 at 15:42) sadie ♦ sadie's gravatar image

don't worry i can repeat it.

thank you that is kinda "cute". ;) mythical days, invisable shaytan whispering in your ear, waswas. jinn eating camel dung. muhammad prescribing camel urineas a medicine. torture as a means of guidance. roflmao.

may america turn you out to the islamic world you love so much, on a very real day. soon. may the nation you have no allegiance to return it ten-fold. :)

(Dec 06 '13 at 15:51) mikejm4 mikejm4's gravatar image

Good cause I really didn't mean too. Okay that entails the allotted time of the day to waste my time. Time to go to work. Have a blessed day mike. Duce's.

(Dec 06 '13 at 16:00) sadie ♦ sadie's gravatar image

Mikejm.   I think your hurt in the head.  This world does not belong to any sort of race or nationality but rather to Allah. America is a land made up of immigrants. Before the settlement of the colonies were the native Americans;  so you have no right to claim that this land belongs to certain people. I am a hypocrite? I sometimes look at islamqa because they present the haqq(truth) .

(Dec 06 '13 at 17:15) Light ♦ Light's gravatar image

Prophet Muhammad peace be upon him said: Narrated 'Abdullah bin 'Amr: "The Prophet said, "Whoever has the following four (characteristics) will be a pure hypocrite and whoever has one of the following four characteristics will have one characteristic of hypocrisy unless and until he gives it up. 1 Whenever he is entrusted, he betrays.  2 Whenever he speaks, he tells a lie.  3 Whenever he makes a covenant, he proves treacherous. 

U have this 4 Whenever he quarrels, he behaves in a very imprudent, evil and insulting manner."  (Translation of Sahih Bukhari, Belief, Volume 1, Book 2, Number 33)"

(Dec 06 '13 at 17:21) Light ♦ Light's gravatar image

i think you mean "you're", but no i've never been head injured. but i do know people who have and it is no laughing matter. anyway, what ever college you went to, you should go ask them for your money back. or was it paid for on the taxpayers dime? "This world does not belong to any sort of race or nationality but rather to Allah." so you don't believe in any nations? there should be open borders? so the jews or the christians or the hindus or the buddhist have as much right to occupy mecca or medina or jerusalem as anyone? you sure you aren't a hypocrite?

(Dec 06 '13 at 17:36) mikejm4 mikejm4's gravatar image

"America is a land made up of immigrants." first that isn't true. most american are native born. but if you want to go back generations, so what. i didn't say stop immigration. i think immigrants who come to america to intigrate and be faithful americans are great for this country.
"Before the settlement of the colonies were the native Americans;" duh. "so you have no right to claim that this land belongs to certain people." i'm making no such claim, as far as a certain race or creed of people, other than you be loyal to the foundation, the constitution. so i take it you aren't a citizen.

(Dec 06 '13 at 17:44) mikejm4 mikejm4's gravatar image

@Light don't worry about mike he will get over it he always does. The brother Omid Gol is who must be watched for he is propagating unislamic concepts. You have expect what mike gives for we all know his position, he is not saying he is muslim and talking bidah and kufr. He says he has a web site that is to stop backward people like me from spreading my backward beleif to mainstream Muslims. This my belived brother is what we must speakout against. Mike will mike he has proven that. Salaam

(Dec 06 '13 at 17:52) yaqin ♦ yaqin's gravatar image

yaqin luckily you were born here, right? so can your beloved brother light become an american? you gotta take an oath to be naturalized. can he employe tayyiah (however you spell that) to help proper islam get a better foothold in this hemisphere? no books left behind by the prophets over here?

see poor omid gol had the miss fortune of being a sunni born in iran before the revolution.

let light speak for himself. maybe the college boy has a newer sword. appearently your's is too dull to handle my kind, isn't that what you said? i know how to handle mike malzahn. ;) shalom.

(Dec 06 '13 at 18:06) mikejm4 mikejm4's gravatar image

light, you can call me evil and insulting all you like. but it is muslims who claim that they must be given the high road. it is muslims who claim they are superior.

aren't you in america studying? lol.

(Jul 15 at 14:12) mikejm4 mikejm4's gravatar image
showing 5 of 15 show all

What would be wrong with that? You're not worshiping the flag, your simply pleading allegiance to your nation. There's nothing wrong with that.

You're not performing shirk until you're literally and figuratively worshiping someone or something other than Allah.

Many so called scholars of Islam say that saying "Ya Mohammad" is a form of shirk. This is far from the truth.

Imam Bukhari, Hafidhh Ibn Taymiyya and Qadi Shawkani all posed a question, that if a person’s foot becomes numb, what should he do? Their recommendations were the same, and included with their answer, the following hadith:

Some time after RasoolAllah, (May Allah bless him and grant him peace), had passed away, ‘Abd Allah Ibn ‘Umar was in Najd where one day his foot became numb. As a remedy to alleviate the pain, a person said to him. “Remember the one whom you love the most!” Upon hearing this Ibn ‘Umar said “Ya Mohammad!" and his foot made an immediate recovery from numbness.

Guided Islam

answered 212 Omid%20Gol's gravatar image

@omid Gol I like your analogy it is interesting but I want to ask what about what Allah azza wal jall has stated in the book and I qoute, if any do fail to judge by what Allah has revealed, they are kafirun. Sura 5:44inpart. So is it alright to pledge to a system that does not judge by what Allah has revealed?

(Dec 03 '13 at 22:11) yaqin ♦ yaqin's gravatar image

@yaqin 5:44 in the Qur'an states that Allah has created laws for us to follow. It simply says to follow them, Allah has set a religion for us, Islam.

"So judge between them by what Allah has revealed and do not follow their inclinations away from what has come to you of the truth. To each of you We prescribed a law and a method." Qur'an 5:48

You should also know that most parts of the American justice system were extracted straight from Quranic Sharia law.

(Dec 03 '13 at 23:50) Omid Gol Omid%20Gol's gravatar image

Beloved what do you mean by us? Islam is the guidance for mankind. You say some of the laws are extracted from the quran, This is true but the majority come from pagan hellenistic practice. Are you of the mindset that we believe in some of the book? You used 5:48 to imply what? It is a known fact that laws were given before islam but Allah had commanded that the Rasul judge by what was revealed to him. For islam is Allah azza wal jall favor perfected for mankind. If you choose to pledge allegiance, ma'shallah. But one should not pass it off as islamic. This is not the haqq. Salaam

(Dec 04 '13 at 00:29) yaqin ♦ yaqin's gravatar image

omid gol, dude, most american law comes from british common law. which is certainly influence by pagan hellenist philosophy as well as judeo-christian law. along side muhammad at the supreme court is moses and other law givers. we freely mix our pagan and abrahamic symbols. we take the good laws and leave the bad, hopefully. the washington monument is an obelisk, the statue of liberty is based on the roman goddess libertas and lady justice, the blindfolded woman holding scales and a sword also roman goddess, justice or the greek equivalent, dike. the staute in the video, staue of freedom,

(Dec 04 '13 at 10:27) mikejm4 mikejm4's gravatar image

purely american. "Courtroom friezes: The South Wall Frieze includes figures of lawgivers from the ancient world and includes Menes, Hammurabi, Moses, Solomon, Lycurgus, Solon, Draco, Confucius, and Augustus. The North Wall Frieze shows lawgivers from the Middle Ages on and includes representations of Justinian, Muhammad, Charlemagne, John of England, Louis IX of France, Hugo Grotius, Sir William Blackstone, John Marshall, and Napoleon."

don't know about draco in there? even an easterner with confucius, would have never quessed.

(Dec 04 '13 at 10:33) mikejm4 mikejm4's gravatar image

Mike, you're right, many parts of the American justice system is not Islamic, however, there are still some Sharia elements. Remember, Prophet Mohammad (SAW) was not only a religious leader, but also a secular leader, for example, he was a social reformer, diplomat, merchant, philosopher, orator, legislator, military leader, humanitarian, and last but not least, a philanthropist.

This was why he was voted as the world's most influential person in history:

(Dec 04 '13 at 13:33) Omid Gol Omid%20Gol's gravatar image

As for mr. Yaqin, you should remember that nothing in the Qur'an prohibits a Muslim to respect and provide loyalty to their nation.

Islam calls for all Muslims to be peaceful, to cooperate with non-Muslims, to maintain justice for all mankind, and to provide happiness and welfare of humanity as a whole.

Please remember cack during the times of the prophet, some Muslims were living in some territories that were governed by Jewish law, even still, they were loyal to their nation. Prophet Mohammad (SAW) commanded the Muslims to act in this manner.

(Dec 04 '13 at 13:38) Omid Gol Omid%20Gol's gravatar image

thanks for the wiki page, very interesting. but unless i misread it, the author hart, named muhammad the most influencial person, there was no vote. not that i don't agree with his hypothesis that without paul christianity probably would not have spread as much as it did. then again one could argue that without abu bakr violently holding some converts in the fold the same could be said islam. and of course the preceding dynsties. anyway, like 311 said, what a man was 2000 (or 1400) years ago means nothing to me today. the question is can there even be a secularism within islam. the muslims

(Dec 04 '13 at 14:06) mikejm4 mikejm4's gravatar image

i've spoken to say that islam is an "all encompasing" religion. as in there is no seperation of religion and governance. so all those secular things he did, he did without "god's guidence"? i like your fiqh but it is confusing me. let me ask you this. if in 100 years america is 60% muslim, should sharia be imposed instead of the constitution? 80%? 90% in a thousand years?

or should muslims today be allowed to introduce sharia into american courts? or set up a parallel system based on sharia?

thanks for the afghan update. good news.

(Dec 04 '13 at 14:14) mikejm4 mikejm4's gravatar image

@omid Gol, beloved the Rasul ordered muslims not to cause mischeif in the land, islam teaches the muslim to abide by the law of the land they live When a muslim gives baya first it must be done fisibillah and second it must be done with ittebah of the Rasul, meaning it must be done the way he did it or said to do it.Beloved you are wrong the Rasul saws never denounced his kinsmen as we shouldn't for that would severing the ties of the womb and this is haram, but taking an oath under the banner of an illa is a form of shirk. You can't show me one ayat or half of hadith that supports your qiyas.

(Dec 04 '13 at 14:51) yaqin ♦ yaqin's gravatar image

Please bear in mind that the first to use qiyas opinion was the shaytan. In following the best example, you are correct we are to respect those that are not muslim and be kind to them especially if we live in their land for this is a form of dawah, but our loyalty is to the brotherhood of islam. I reject your rheteric on the grounds that what you suggest is not of islam, and again if you choose to do it, so be it that is between you and your rabb. It is when you put it out there like it is part of the sunnah that I have a problem with. I sense from your words that I may have offended you if so

(Dec 04 '13 at 15:07) yaqin ♦ yaqin's gravatar image

please accept my humble apology for never is that my intention. I strongly dislike bidah and what you suggest is that. Salaam

(Dec 04 '13 at 15:09) yaqin ♦ yaqin's gravatar image

To what NATION? Ha get out of here with that. The only nation I would pledge to is the one Allah made for us Muslims and the iteebah of our beloved Rasul sallallahu allahi wa Salam. I seek refuge with Allah from what your standing for beloved brother. Salaam

(Dec 04 '13 at 22:16) sadie ♦ sadie's gravatar image
showing 5 of 13 show all

@yaqin, Again, how is that shirk?

Like I've said before, You're not performing shirk until you're literally and figuratively worshiping someone or something other than Allah.

Your simply following the law of your nation, your not worshiping the law, your not believing in what the law says or teaches, your simply respecting your nation.

Please remember, thousands of Americans disagree with the American justice system, yet they still say the pledge of allegiance to show respect for their nation.

You should look over the pledge of allegiance, it's only saying what a great country America is. The lyrics never refer to the secular law system, or anything like that. When you say the pledge of allegiance, your only respecting your country, nothing else.

In fact, the lyrics say that America is one nation under GOD. The term "In God we Trust" is used all over American currency. America is more religious than what you see on media these days.

answered 212 Omid%20Gol's gravatar image

@omid Gol beloved cant believe what I'm reading, I seek refuge with Allah from your mindset. I told you about the hellenistic foundation layed and mike went further and the facts you can't negate. In God we trust, one nation under god, what god beloved. The word God has its roots in the same hellenistic foundation as the great America. Here lies your shirk. You made a statement of shirk, ok, tell me the aspects of shirk and all it entails. When you call on or accept any name other than Allah and the 81 names Allah has described in the quran and the 18 the Rasul called Him. EVERYTHING after

(Dec 04 '13 at 21:30) yaqin ♦ yaqin's gravatar image

@yaqin haha who taught you that? I'm sorry, but I believe your the many Salafi Wahabi out there that say that every living thing that moves is considered shirk.

It doesn't matter if you call on anything, as long as your not worshiping someone other than Allah, as long as you fully believe in your heart that there is one Almighty creator, ALLLAH (SWT), your not committing shirk. The entire Qur'an and hadith will agree with me.

Congrats on spreading your version of Islam, I'm sure it will greatly benefit the Muslim community.

(Dec 04 '13 at 21:36) Omid Gol Omid%20Gol's gravatar image

@yaqin The word God means nothing but creator, just like in Persian, the word KHODA means the same thing.

Please remember my friend, only 220 million Muslims speak Arabic, the rest of us don't usually use the word Allah. Depending on where your from and what language you speak, you would say what "God" is in your language.

For example, the Persian term "Khodavande Mehraban" is a popular saying that means "God the Merciful".

(Dec 04 '13 at 21:44) Omid Gol Omid%20Gol's gravatar image

that is a taghoot. You are speaking without knowledge, within EVERY taghoot is shirk. You don't have to pledge to anything to follow the laws of the land. Saying the allegiance is not the law of the land, this is a oath. I see that you overlooked haqq on fisbillah and the itteebah of our beloved Rasul. Read 33:36, inshallah it will shed some light on your position. Any oath that id taken must be done islamically, its has nothing to with America the great country as you say. Salaam

(Dec 04 '13 at 21:51) yaqin ♦ yaqin's gravatar image

@yaqin Sorry friend, your not making any sense, maybe you need more guidance in Islamic studies.

Please go here,

Me along with many other Sunni Iranian-American Muslims have created this website to stop ignorant ones like you from spreading their backward beliefs to us mainstream Muslims.

(Dec 04 '13 at 21:54) Omid Gol Omid%20Gol's gravatar image

He makes perfect sense. May Allah guide you. Salaam

(Dec 04 '13 at 22:16) sadie ♦ sadie's gravatar image

Asalaamu 3Alaykum Omid Gol maybe no one has ever taught you this so alhamdulillahee I will . When you speak with your brothers and sisters in Islam you give your salutations. And sense you have much ilm alhamdulillah maybe you can tell me what three categories of belief was taught by the Rasul sallallahu allahi WA Salam ? I wait your reply. Saalaam

(Dec 04 '13 at 22:33) sadie ♦ sadie's gravatar image

@omid Gol, first brother I'm not salifi and you sound like a Mutazillah, present your proof on what you said about God being equal to Allah when the origin of the word is in paganism. If your website is upon what you are upon then it is a website of kufr and I want no parts of it. It is you who is not making sense the problem with ummah is people like you with your mainstream bidah. You say the quran and hadith supports you present your proof. I don't believe you know what tagjoot is. the Persian word you used can you say it in prayer and it be accepted? No! And the reason is because it is a

(Dec 04 '13 at 22:48) yaqin ♦ yaqin's gravatar image

Taghoot and Allah azza wal jall has commanded us in the quran to stay away from taghoot. So you and your mainstream brothers need guidance in islamic studies. Brother you are speading misguidance with your mainstream bidah I'm not going to ask you that. I will however ask yhat you keep it to your self. Salaam

(Dec 04 '13 at 22:58) yaqin ♦ yaqin's gravatar image

@yaqin Prayer is different, prayer is explained by Hadith, it is meant to be read in Arabic.

The Qur'an is in Arabic, so using Persian wouldn't make sense now would it?

99% of Muslims use the word "GOD", you're the first that brings such belief. You continue to talk on without any evidence from Qur'an or Authentic Hadith.

The Qiyamat is approaching, when Muslims start making what is Halal into Haram and what is Haram into Halal.

(Dec 04 '13 at 23:00) Omid Gol Omid%20Gol's gravatar image

Also you need to go to your website of kufr for the haqq can't be stopped, your innovation is what needs to be stopped, say pledge of shirk. Salaam

(Dec 04 '13 at 23:01) yaqin ♦ yaqin's gravatar image

@sadie Brother, I've said Salam in a previous post. Not all Muslims are perfect, and I'm sure your not even close to perfect.

Please don't tell me that you say Salam to every single person you see because you would be lying.

These days, if one were to say Salam to a stranger, they would think they were crazy.

It's a shame, but society is changing, what can we do?

You and your buddy are both spreading bidah.

ALLAH means GOD in Arabic. You should remember that the term Allah was in use before Islam. Even the polytheists before Islam had named one of their god's Allah.

(Dec 04 '13 at 23:06) Omid Gol Omid%20Gol's gravatar image

salaam Omid. Are you aware that Jews once replaced the name Yahweh with lesser names like Adoney, El, Elohim , Baal? Insha Allah you do know this. That being said . Are you suggesting that Allah needs to be replaced or substituted for the word God?

(Dec 04 '13 at 23:09) sadie ♦ sadie's gravatar image

In order for me to be partaking in an innovation I would have to be implementing something new into the deen. By calling Allah Allah and Allah only I am not making a bidah. I am simply doing what Allah has asked me too do. He has the most beautiful names and the word God isn't one of them . Salaam

(Dec 04 '13 at 23:14) sadie ♦ sadie's gravatar image

True and oaths are also described in the hadith. You made a blanket statement about 99percent this is not true. I gave you the requirement of pledging baya and I gave you what we must stay away from and that being taghoot. I'm going to post the debate on this topic I suggest you read it and inshallah you will stop commiting shirk. Your last comment describes you and your doings. Salaam

(Dec 04 '13 at 23:15) yaqin ♦ yaqin's gravatar image

@sadie You misunderstood me, I never said that, I only said that GOD means ALLAH. It's not a different word, it's the same word. - -

There are 100's if not thousands of more websites that support that Allah means God.

The Arab Christians and Jews use the term Allah, yet they refer to Jesus. They don't even believe in the 99 names of Allah and yet they use the term Allah.

(Dec 04 '13 at 23:15) Omid Gol Omid%20Gol's gravatar image

@yaqin I'm surprised to see that my own Muslim brothers can be so ignorant and misguided. How can one be so ignorant? Did you learn your Islamic education in a cave somewhere my friend?

(Dec 04 '13 at 23:19) Omid Gol Omid%20Gol's gravatar image

Insults won't work brother you made a statement that you can't back up Allah means god I posted the haqq in the post Allah and god refute it. You are ahlul bidah brother and I will make dua for you. Read the post if you dear to know the haqq. Salaam

(Dec 04 '13 at 23:27) yaqin ♦ yaqin's gravatar image

I have not misunderstood you brother. You are attributing the attributes of Allah and only do they belong to him TO A PAGAN WORD. I seek refuge on Allah from that. Now this isn't about snide comments or about insults so I ask for the sake of brotherhood stop it. You understand that the English language has not been around as long as Aramaic or Hebrew correct?

(Dec 04 '13 at 23:28) sadie ♦ sadie's gravatar image

Oh so the internet is your shaykh I understand now why you are so misguided, beloved my heart crys for you wallahee. I pray that Allah azza wal jall removes the blinders from your eyes. Well I posted the haqq go to your shaykh the internet and refute it. Salaam

(Dec 04 '13 at 23:47) yaqin ♦ yaqin's gravatar image

OG, come on now, you know "under god" was added in the 50s to fight the godlless communists and in god we trust wasn't originally on money either. btw, yaqin and sadie (sarah) are americans, can you believe that?

not sure what oath a congressman takes, probably same as the president, (uphold the constitution, all enemies foriegn and domestic) so i'll ask my shaykh, wiki... opps came up first.

original "I do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will support the Constitution of the United States."

(Dec 05 '13 at 10:39) mikejm4 mikejm4's gravatar image

now: "I do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; that I take this obligation freely, without any mental reservation or purpose of evasion; and that I will well and faithfully discharge the duties of the office on which I am about to enter: So help me God." somehow that pagan god keep creeping it's way in. ;)

goodluck with this debate. he's no salaf but he's headstrong. you know what they say, it takes one to know one.

(Dec 05 '13 at 10:41) mikejm4 mikejm4's gravatar image

@mikejm4 They're both brain dead, everything is considered shirk or pagan to them.

(Dec 05 '13 at 10:52) Omid Gol Omid%20Gol's gravatar image

yaqin/sadie, so you think keith ellison is upon the shirk? so no muslim can hold an office or join an organization that requires a pledge? and chris jackson was right not to stand for the national anthem. or muslim school children shouldn't say the pledge before class? so can a muslim testify in court if they make you "swear to tell the truth, nothing put the truth, so help you god". that one ironically enough may have been taken out now, don't know never testified in court.

btw, i think it's a little below y'all to talk down to each other like that. i know muslims love the word ignorant,

(Dec 05 '13 at 10:56) mikejm4 mikejm4's gravatar image

Omid your unislamic . Probably working for the US government . Believers don't call each other brain dead. Its not the way of the rasul sallallahu allahi wasalam. No mike I don't need to say it. Did when I was a kid and didn't see the world clearly. Im not commiting myself or my family to isn't place or country. All praise is to Allah the most high the supreme . I don't care what others might do for it is their qadr and they have the right to choose. I will not speak on this any longer for the sake of brotherhood. Salaam

(Dec 05 '13 at 11:04) sadie ♦ sadie's gravatar image

but you should save it for people like me. these are small comment boxes and y'all are jumping to too many conclusion on your first interaction. i know y'all are passionate about avoiding shirk and bidah, and are concerned about what interpretation of islam is being projected and pushed around the world but debate is not lecture.

anyway, yaqin/sadie i see in the original oath it looks like you could subsitute "swear" with "affirm". what is you could say allah instead of god. or better yet god was left out totally.

merry christmas. my bad, happy holidays.

(Dec 05 '13 at 11:08) mikejm4 mikejm4's gravatar image

@sadie Yes, when someone is doing something wrong you tell them, if they don't listen after 3 times, you tell them they are in the wrong path. You're all my brothers, I love all you so much, but, if you're doing something, I'll try to stop you.

You're here saying I'm "UNISLAMIC", how can that be possible when I pray 5 times a day, I memorized the Qur'an, I fast, I believe there is no god but Allah and Mohammad is his messenger, I pay Zakat, and I go to hajj. Who are YOU to say I'm unislamic

Remember when the Prophet Mohammad (SAW) said, "Always speak the truth, even when the truth may hurt."

(Dec 05 '13 at 12:06) Omid Gol Omid%20Gol's gravatar image

@omid Gol beloved what was said is what you presented is unislamic, no one has made takfeer on you, only what you presented as haqq. I presented the debate on this subject and you never got back to me. Brother I feel the same as you do and I'm born and raised in America so I understand clearly. So as you say I must stop you when I see you are wrong about a issue as serious as this. The Rasul saws said what he feared most for his ummah was shirk al khafi, inconspicious shirk, and described it as a black ant on a black rock in the thick of darkness. Meaning you may not see it but it is there.

(Dec 05 '13 at 15:23) yaqin ♦ yaqin's gravatar image

This my brother is very prevalent today in the deen, and dealing with the topic we have been discussing this shirk al khafi is there for all one has to do is dig alittle deeper than the surface and it would be clear that all that is of the mindset of attributing god to Allah azza wal jall are in error. It has been reported that the Rasul said,"My ummah will follow the jews and Christian so much that if they go into a lizard hole they follow them."I seek refuge with Allah from that. Salaam

(Dec 05 '13 at 15:31) yaqin ♦ yaqin's gravatar image

Oh, and I'am brain dead to ignorance, ignorance not meaning you are stupid, ignorance meaning you ignore facts. Also everything isn't shirk or pagan just the things that are. I'm no stranger to the deen beloved. I see you presented your credentials, that does not impress me what I look for is how you implement what you have for it only becomes wisdom when you apply it. If not it is just information. Salaam

(Dec 05 '13 at 15:55) yaqin ♦ yaqin's gravatar image

Omid true or false. Every believer is a Muslim not every Muslim is a believer. ? What does it take to become a believer? Salaam

(Dec 05 '13 at 16:25) sadie ♦ sadie's gravatar image
showing 5 of 31 show all
  1. Ibn `Umar (May Allah be pleased with them) said: The Prophet (sallallaahu ’alayhi wa sallam) said, "Allah has prohibited you from taking an oath by your fathers. He who must take an oath, may do so by swearing in the Name of Allah or he should remain silent.'' [Al-Bukhari and Muslim].

  2. `Abdur-Rahman bin Samurah (May Allah be pleased with him) said: The Messenger of Allah (sallallaahu ’alayhi wa sallam) said, "Swear neither by the name of Taghut (i.e., false deities, false leaders, etc.) nor by your fathers.'' [Muslim].

  3. Buraidah (May Allah be pleased with him) said: The Messenger of Allah (sallallaahu ’alayhi wa sallam) said, "He who swears by Amanah (trust) is not one of us.'' [Abu Dawud with authentic Isnad].

  4. Ibn Umar (May Allah be pleased with them) said: I heard a man saying: "No, by the Kabah.'' I admonished him: "Do not swear by any thing besides Allah, for I heard the Messenger of Allah (sallallaahu ’alayhi wa sallam) saying, `He who swears by anyone or anything other than Allah, has indeed committed an act of Kufr or Shirk'.'' [At-Tirmidhi].

Web link:

answered 151 Osman%20Celik's gravatar image

@osman celik may Allah azza wal jall reward you for the haqq you have presented, everything I told the brother Omid Gol you have confirmed with the hadith. Salaam

(Dec 06 '13 at 17:38) yaqin ♦ yaqin's gravatar image
Your answer
toggle preview

Markdown Basics

  • *italic* or __italic__
  • **bold** or __bold__
  • link:[text]( "title")
  • image?![alt text](/path/img.jpg "title")
  • numbered list: 1. Foo 2. Bar
  • to add a line break simply add two spaces to where you would like the new line to be.
  • basic HTML tags are also supported



Asked: Dec 03 '13 at 12:35

Seen: 1,541 times

Last updated: Jul 15 at 14:12

©1998-2013 Publications and Research.       All Rights Reserved.