Can someone explain why , if Muslims believe the Bible has been "corrupted" in many places ... why then , do they (Muslims) often reference this same Bible when attempting to validate Muhammad as a prophet ???
firstly I'd like to say Muslims do not denounce other religions, but as we know through time man has changed the Bible it influenced by the devil. I suggest if you care watch http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MQWfhscudKc (from the history Channel which can explain a 12 part video each 8 min long, watch it you'll understand) so it is a Known fact in history. Muslims brothers and sisters you should watch it too it is, interesting.
In the end All holy books from Psalm, Old testament, Bible and Quran came down for the same reasons Glad tiding (heaven for the Good people) and a warning (hell bad people), God has created us to worship him and thank him, and those who follow him will enter paradise and be around God and live a life so grand. Now, God wants every one to enter paradise free willed and he knows past and future everything, God has sent down many messengers to warn us, and often times God sees us stray and tries to send us to the right path again, he is MOST forgiving, but you can't force some one to appreciate you. God believes we have so many blessing and great perfections around us we should not have any doubt in our creator God. God does not need us but, we need him and God is wise when he created us, as human we have the tenuousness to forget, that is why Islam is always making us pray fast and give to charity and read the Quran, in this book we are reminded of death and the life-after because this life is nothing compared to the after -life everlasting. God wants us to live in peace and treat those like we would want to be treated and be good examples, and those who transgress will be punished (yes, we see evil minded people in all religions, they do not represent any faiths, especially Islam). The Devil himself was a Follower of God until he disobeyed God, and then God cast him out of the Garden/heaven, and intended to punish him. Iblis (devil) begged God to delay the punishment until the Last Day (the Day of Judgment): this God granted, as God is Most Merciful, and that devil said he wants try stray humans (because he thought of Humans having being made from clay were unworthy of paradise, he was created by smokeless fire he was snobby, arrogant and jealous of the love God had for us, and Adam as was termed "the Best of Creation"). so in the end, What I'm saying is every time God sent messengers as a mercy for mankind, the devils strays us except for the Quran, it is the Complete book, perfect religion no mistake everything is wise and logic, God has perfected this book and no one can even come close, the Quran can not be tampered and should be memorized too, so we can not forget the messege, and stray. God loves us we need to see that, when other prophets came they all were very loyal to God and prayed and fasted and so should we. The followers of these prophets after they had died, and people started forgetting the message sent down and strayed the path, devil would say to the people "oh change this line in the holy book, you'll get more followers if it were easier", or "build a Statue (idol) of a prophet (ex. Jesus, Mary, and many other...) so you and the generations to come, can remember them " but the generations to come, do not know why these statues were build so they just pray to it and visualize them in there prayer instead, an Idol made by man, or symbolizing a Creation by God, not praying for the almighty Creator God. In the Quran God tells us, if you doubt for one second of the creator Look around you at the perfection of life and creation and you'll know God is around us all at all time. LIFE is a Test, if you pass you'll success, do bad and you Fail. Do not waste your time, life is too short and God loves you, he is most forgiving. So instead of asking what verse of the bible are corrupted, go read about all religions especially Islam, and see which is closet to paradise, and to closer God. God has rules to make our life easy, and in Islam God say's, everything in life is permissible expect that of which God has prohibited for you ex. drinking alcohol, eating pork, and meat which is already dead, cheating, gambling, lying, killing of innocent people, and adultery, are prohibited for us, but God is most forgiving & most merceful and we as should human-beings must be forgiving too, and those who stray and repent those who were sensere, God will forgive, but why do what God told us which is not good for you? just stay a way and do good, very easy. God will always stand by you. Read read read and educate
No one can prove that all bible books which is in the world is same, there is so many deference in all bibles, but all bible accept that Mohammad is the prophet of Allah, and Quran Also says, when Muslims give refrence of bible that is just for Christensen peoples only, because they all have full Aqida on bibles,
Salam brothers and sisters-
I am new to this page and saw this discussion and was interested to see the responses. I am a used-to-be Christian that came to Islam. It was taught to me at a very young age that things were taken out of and put into the Bible. It was also taught to me that while Allah was there for the creation of the book, so was Shaitan. Things that were taken out were of importance to mankind, and Shaitan made it so it would be difficult for an individual to receive a full understanding of the teaching of Allah. The changing of and/or omitting of names of pivotal prophets is just one example of the corruption that the Vatican participated in for one of the original Words of Allah. Let us remember, this is Shaitan's world that we live in, and he will do his best to dumb down mankind's devotion to Allah. The Vatican has not touched any part of the Qur'an -Alhamdullah-, and so that is why the Qur'an is the purest Word of Allah. I suggest youtubing Sheikh Ahmed Deedat (pbuh) to give a better understanding about this discussion-inshallah.
how many different Bibles have read and found them all to be the same, even with in the same branch ??? but in Islam there is only One Quran (holy Book) no matter the different branches and about 90% are the majority Sunni still all other branches use the one same book, and are united, and that's why it is encouraged to recite in Arabic even if you do not speak the language, and remembered that as much and other languages try to translate there is no change in the originality text it is forbidden.
I will not tell you why the Bible is corrupted, I think that if you ask each church or priest about; 1. how we were created in details and our purpose, 2. the creation of Jesus (PBUH)and death of Jesus (PBUH), 3. what happens after we die, what's the after life like? and if you are not convinced of different stories then ask about each the stories of the Prophets before us and their purpose to each tribe or people? and then go to any mosque Imam (or even muslim Person)ask the same Questions and I bet you'll see the straight and understanding answers no turns no confusion you'll feel at ease that it makes scene anywhere you go. You will see everything has a Purpose but, that is if you are afraid you might hear the answers you needed so clear and compare yourself (DONT ASSUME YOU KNOW EVERYTHING EVEN WITHIN YOUR OWN RELIGION STUDY) even in Islam God tells to us to compare yourself and study other religions and study Philosophy because Allah is Convinced that we will not doubt in the beauty of Islam.
I will say why the Quarn is not corrupted. Praise be to Allaah.
Allaah has guaranteed to preserve this Qur’aan Himself. Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):
“Verily, We, it is We Who have sent down the Dhikr (i.e. the Qur’aan) and surely, We will guard it (from corruption)”
[al-Hijr 15:9] Ibn Jareer al-Tabari said in his Tafseer, 14/8:
Allaah is saying, it is We Who have sent down the Dhikr (Reminder), i.e. the Qur’aan, and We will guard the Qur’aan against anything false being added to it that is not part of it, or anything that is part of it being taken away, whether that has to do with rulings, hudood punishments or matters having to do with inheritance.
Al-Sa’di said in his Tafseer (p. 696):
It is We Who have sent down the Qur’aan in which there is mention of all issues and clear evidence, and in which We remind those who want to be reminded.
“and surely, We will guard it” means, when it is being revealed and after it has been revealed. When it is revealed, We protect it from the tampering of every accursed devil, and after it has been revealed Allaah instilled it in the heart of His Messenger. Allaah protected the words from being changed and from anything being added or taken away, or from its meanings being distorted. So no one can attempt to distort its meanings but Allaah will guide someone to explain the truth of the Qur’aan. This is one of the greatest signs of Allaah and His blessing to His believing slaves. Another aspect of this protection is that Allaah protects the people of the Qur’aan against their enemies, and no enemy can overpower them and eliminate them.
The Qur’aan was revealed to the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) in stages over a period of twenty-three years. Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):
“And (it is) a Qur’aan which We have divided (into parts), in order that you might recite it to men at intervals. And We have revealed it by stages”
al-Sa’di (may Allaah have mercy on him) said:
This means, We have revealed this Qur’aan in stages, to differentiate between guidance and misguidance, between truth and falsehood.
“in order that you might recite it to men at intervals” means, slowly, so that they may ponder and think about its meanings, and understand the different branches of knowledge contained therein.
“And We have revealed it by stages” means, gradually, over a period of twenty-three years.
Tafseer al-Sa’di, p. 760.
Literacy was not widespread among the Arabs. Allaah described them in such terms when He said (interpretation of the meaning):
“He it is Who sent among the unlettered ones a Messenger (Muhammad) from among themselves”
They used to memorize the Qur’aan by heart, and a few of them used to write down some verses or soorahs on animal skins, thin white stones and the like.
Thirdly: At first the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) forbade the writing of anything other than the Qur’aan, and he forbade them to write down his words for a while, so that the Sahaabah would focus on memorizing the Qur’aan and writing it down, and so that the words of the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) would not be confused with the words of Allaah, and so the Qur’aan was protected from anything being added or taken away.
The Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) appointed a group of his companions who were trustworthy and knowledgeable to write down the revelation. They are known in their biographies as those who wrote down the Revelation, such as the four Caliphs, ‘Abd-Allaah ibn ‘Amr ibn al-‘Aas, Mu’aawiyah ibn Abi Sufyaan, Zayd ibn Thaabit and others – may Allaah be pleased with them all.
The Qur’aan was revealed in seven dialects as was narrated in the saheeh hadeeth of ‘Umar ibn al-Khattaab (may Allaah be pleased with him) from the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him). This was narrated by al-Bukhaari (2287) and Muslim (818); these were the dialects of the Arabs which were known for their eloquence.
The Qur’aan continued to be preserved in the hearts of the Sahaabah who had memorized it, and on the skins and other materials until the time of the caliph Abu Bakr al-Siddeeq (may Allaah be pleased with him). During the Riddah wars many of the Sahaabah who had memorized the Qur’aan were killed, and Abu Bakr (may Allaah be pleased with him) was afraid that the Qur’aan would be lost. So he consulted the senior Sahaabah about compiling the Qur’aan in a single book so that it would remain preserved and would not be lost. He entrusted this mission to the chief of memorizers Zayd ibn Thaabit (may Allaah be pleased with him). Al-Bukhaari narrated in his Saheeh (4986) that Zayd ibn Thaabit (may Allaah be pleased with him) said:
Abu Bakr al-Siddeeq sent for me when the people of al-Yamaamah had been killed [i.e., a number of the Prophet's Companions who fought against the false prophet Musaylimah]. (I went to him) and found ‘Umar ibn al-Khattaab sitting with him. Abu Bakr then said (to me), “ ‘Umar has come to me and said: ‘Casualties were heavy among the Qurra' of the Qur'aan (i.e. those who knew the Qur’aan by heart) on the day of the battle of al-Yamaamah, and I am afraid that more heavy casualties may take place among the Qurra' on other battlefields, whereby a large part of the Qur’aan may be lost. Therefore I suggest that you (Abu Bakr) order that the Qur’aan be collected.” I said to 'Umar, "How can you do something that the Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) did not do?" 'Umar said, "By Allah, this is something good." 'Umar kept on urging me to accept his proposal till Allaah opened my heart to it and I began to realize the good in the idea which 'Umar had realized." Then Abu Bakr said (to me). “You are a wise young man and we do not have any suspicion about you, and you used to write the Divine Inspiration for the Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him). So search for (the fragmentary scripts of) the Qur’aan and compile it in one book." By Allah If they had ordered me to move one of the mountains, it would not have been heavier for me than this ordering me to compile the Qur’aan. Then I said (to Abu Bakr), "How can you do something that the Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) did not do?" Abu Bakr replied, "By Allaah, it is a good thing." Abu Bakr kept on urging me to accept his idea until Allaah opened my heart to that to which He had opened the hearts of Abu Bakr and 'Umar. So I started looking for the Qur’aan and collecting it from (what it was written on) palm stalks, thin white stones and also from the men who knew it by heart, until I found the last Verse of Soorat al-Tawbah with Abu Khuzaymah al-Ansaari, and I did not find it with anybody other than him. The verse is (interpretation of the meaning):
"Verily, there has come unto you a Messenger (Muhammad) from amongst yourselves. It grieves him that you should receive any injury or difficulty...” [al-Tawbah 9:128] until the end of Soorat Baraa’ah (i.e., al-Tawbah).
Then the complete manuscript (copy) of the Qur’aan remained with Abu Bakr until he died, then with 'Umar until the end of his life, and then with Hafsah, the daughter of 'Umar (may Allaah be pleased with him).
The Sahaabi Zayd ibn Thaabit (may Allaah be pleased with him) knew the Qur’aan by heart but he was methodical in his confirmation; he would not agree to write down any verse until two of the Sahaabah testified that they had heard it from the Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him).
This Mus-haf (written copy of the Qur’aan) remained in the hands of the caliphs until the time of the Rightly-Guided Caliph ‘Uthmaan ibn ‘Affaan (may Allaah be pleased with him). The Sahaabah (may Allaah be pleased with them) had dispersed to different lands, and they used to recite the Qur’aan according to what they had heard of the seven recitations from the Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him), and each of their students used to recite according to what he had heard from his shaykh. If a student heard someone reciting in a manner different from what he knew, he would denounce him and accuse him of making a mistake, and this went on until the Sahaabah feared that there would be fitnah (trouble) between the Taabi’een and successive generations. So they thought that they should unite the people in following one recitation, which was in the dialect of Quraysh in which the Qur’aan had first been revealed, so as to dispel any disputes and resolve the matter. ‘Uthmaan (may Allaah be pleased with him) was consulted, and he agreed with this opinion.
Al-Bukhaari narrated in his Saheeh (4988) from Anas ibn Maalik that Hudhayfah ibn al-Yamaan came to ‘Uthmaan at the time when the people of Shaam (Syria) and the people of Iraq were waging war to conquer Armenia and Azerbaijan. Hudhayfah was alarmed by their (the people of Sham and Iraq) differences in the recitation of the Qur’aan, so he said to 'Uthmaan, "O Ameer al-Mu’mineen! Save this nation before they dispute about the Book (Qur’aan) as the Jews and the Christians did before." So 'Uthmaan sent a message to Hafsah saying, "Send us the manuscript of the Qur’aan so that we may make copies of the Mus-haf and we will return the manuscript to you." Hafsah sent it to 'Uthmaan. Then 'Uthmaan ordered Zayd ibn Thaabit, 'Abdullah ibn al-Zubayr, Sa’eed ibn al-‘Aas and ‘Abd al-Rahmaan ibn Haarith ibn Hishaam to copy out the manuscripts
The Bible is not corrupted, nor is there any materialized (physical) evidence to support this accusation other then "hear say." The Bible is the oldest known book; older than the Qur'an. The Qur'an includes many numerous biblical personalities, but only recognizes The Torah of Moses, The Gospels of Jesus, and the Psalms of David, as authentic. Athe Qur'an accuses Jews and Christians of distorting their earlier revelation by intentionally suppressing the truth or by false interpretation, but there is more than enough physical evidence to not only support but thwart any dispute or doubt of its authenticity. (1) For the Old Testament (OT), there are thousands of manuscripts that have been found to support it, 10,000 manuscripts alone found in the Cairo Geniza, in 1947, 600 OT manuscripts found in the Dead Sea caves at Qumran, and the Dead Sea Scrolls, which contain at least fragments of all OT books except Esther, that all date from before the end of the first century A.D. And some to the third century B.C. It is well known that Jewish scribal reverence for Scripture led to it's careful translation. The Greek translation of the OT, the Sepuagint and the Samaritan Pentateuch, both show close similarity to the same biblical books preserved with Jewish tradition. Studies show that 95% of the text is correct word-for-word. After 1,000 years there were no changed in meaning and almost no changes in wording! (2) For the New Testament (NT) it's manuscripts allow it to be translated more accurately and precise than any other ancient text. There are almost 5,700 Greek manuscripts, which in comparison to the typical book from antiquity that would have 7 to 10 manuscripts; Homer's Illiad has the most at 643. The New Testament is the best textually supported book from the ancient world. The earliest NT manuscript is the John Rylands Papyrus, dated between A.D. 117 and 138. Whole books are contained in the Bodmer Papyri from around the year 200, and most of the NT including the Gospels, is available in the Chester Beatty Papyri manuscripts dating to about 250. There are many New Testament manuscripts, which would corroborate it's authenticity. Princeton Prof. Bruce Metzger found that the NT is only a half percent in doubt meaning its without a shadow of a doubt in corrupted and was translated accurately, being 99.9 percent accurate—the best known for any book in from the ancient world. With all this being said, with all the early dates and unmatched accuracy of the OT and NT manuscript copies establish the Bibles reliability well beyond any other book. Thus the Bible which is read today is a trustworthy copy of the original text written from the pens of the prophets and apostles. Muslims believe the Bible to be compromised or doctored by man, but the Bible is not compromised by God using human personalities in its writing any more than when He uses human personality in the spoken word of prophets. There is more than enough evidence to support the Bible and the fact that Jesus lived, died for all our sins that we may have life, was resurrected, and will one day return for His people. As a Christian myself, let me say that I love all my brothers and sisters no matter their race, beliefs, or color. I pray that all who read this would not only open their hearts and minds to what I've written but to Jesus Christ son of the living God, Yahweh, Adonai. Peace and love to all.
Salam my dear brother! There is no doubt that the bible is corrupted!! there is a popular debate about that!! search youtube and type in is bible the book of God (Ahmed deedat) Youll find a lot of things there!! :D
regarding your question why do Muslims use the same reference to validate that Muhammad (pbuh) is the prophet of God! the truth is in my own point of view our holy Quran itself is more than enough to validate that Muhammad (pbuh) is a prophet. Unfortunately, Christian do not believe in Quran so We muslims use the reference which is written in the bible to prove that Muhammad is a prophet. Bible is corrupted but not all of it were altered.
hope this helps!!
What it comes down to is, the Bible tells us that Jesus died, while the Quran-Surah 4:157-158 tells us that he didn’t, and this is an area where we can test our holy books to see which is confirmed by the evidence. If the Bible is incorrect then Christians are practicing a false religion, but if the Quran is incorrect...Whether Christians or Muslims practice what is in there books I do not believe is the question.
Jews would never say "we killed Christ Jesus" because they would never call Jesus, Christ, to them Christ means Messiah. They called Him a blasphemer because he said he was The Christ. Neither would they call him an Apostle of Allah, they hated him and wanted him dead. Why would Allah deceive people into thinking that Christ was not crucified?
evryone knows it was alterd by many different people even christians know that and they plainly say it but they think that since they are saints that rewrite it the saints make it better but if people would understand they would know that Allah dosent send down anything tht needs revision or rewriting it was perfect when God sent it down and by rewriting it they have only ruined it not improved it
another thing the religion is called christianity and yet the true teachings of jesus are not followed through he was circumsized and the majority of christians arent he ate only kosher foods and only muslims and jews do that, he never ate pork and christians do he never drank and in church people drink wine he prayed by putting his head on the floor (and this is in the bible) and only muslims do that he had a beard which is what muslims belive is sunnah and through painting and descriptions we know mary covered her hair and wore loose clothing and this is what is required of women to wear in our religion if they lived in todays time, people would belive they were in fact muslim and they truley were muslims and all of this stuff is belived by christians so why isnt the conclusion belived by them that they were muslims, we follow the teachings of jesus more then the christians do so if you truley wanted to follow jesus explore islam and you wont regret it